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Author Topic: Who Is Your Favorite Tajik Personality?  (Read 32986 times)
rooyintan
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« Reply #60 on: March 15, 2008, 05:02:12 PM »

Quote from: Parsistani;7480
Of course he was an anti-arabi (as ''shia-muslim'') but he also islamized mio. Tajiks of Khurasan who were buddhists and zoroastrians, specially in the own country Sistan and modern Helmand. He also was the cause of the islamization of Sindh and the islamic Dynasty of so-called Sayyids of Ind (Arabs) who served him as governeurs over modern Pakistan and Punjab. Farsi was never dead nor our culture. Even during Abu Muslim it was used by himself and even by his arabic army (he forced them to speak Farsi). The Tahirids, another great Tajiks who gave persian culture and language again it´s pride and using instead of arabic as ''court language''. Those older dynasties were the cause of persian renessance. There are a lot lies about the earlier islamic past which are created by so-called new ''zoroastrians'' and those who are from birth against Muslims. Arabic was, like latin in europe, only the language of science and cleric education while Farsi was still used by Persians and those who were nationalistic enough they wrote cassides, shahnama, poems, histories...or do you think Firdowsi and Abbas Merv were creating a new language that is called today as Farsi? Arabs did a lot of bad thinks including killing, looting, buring..the same what their today awghanic sons do but killing a language was and is not able...

Abu Moslem and Tahirid rulers spoke only Arabic. As for Tahirids they were ashamed to speak Persian!
Rik Khana is correct, Yaqub Lais was the first persian to bring back usage of Persian language. Yaqub unlike others like Abu Moslem, Taher Ibn Hossein, Abdollah Ibn Taher, etc.. who knew persian but would not speak it and only spoke arabic, Yaqub purposefully never learnt Arabic, this is written by many historians that Yaqub did not know a word of Arabic :-) So most probably when he wanted to communicate with those Arab army he was fighting against used translators. Tahirid rulers and Abu Moslem were fundamentalist Sunni Muslims and they not only forced persian population into accepting Islam by force but also seized properties or even killed anyone who refused to accept Islam. Most of Khorasan was islamised under Abu Moslem & later Tahirids.

Yes, many historians wrote that Yaqub was a shiite but there's no written evidence that suggests he spread shiite islam in the region. In midevial times
Alawids(who were descendants of Imam Hasan Mojtaba(PBUH)) introduced Shiite Islam into Mazandaran, Gorgan, Gilan and parts of Khorasan. Actually at the time Khavarej Muslims(proto-Ibadis) were most active in Sistan. For those people who have not heard about Ibadi Islam is the islam practiced by Omani people which reached its peak under Imamate of Muscat in the 17th and 18th century.

As for Zoroastrians & Jews: Ghaznevid Turks and later Seljuq also started killing zoroastrians and Jews by forcefully converting them into Islam. That's when many Zoroastrians those had survived the massacres migrated into India from Sangan(in Iranian khorasan) and found their own city in india calling it Sanjana :-) Later on Safavid rulers also started killing zoroastrians, that's why now i believe there are not many zoroastrians left in Khorasan.

Shiite Islam was further spread under Buyid Dynasty and their relatives Kakuyid Dynasty, then later on in 14th century under the Sarbedarid but shiite islam always remained as minority in Khorasan. With Safavid Empire established in Iran, shiite islam became official religion of the state, so Khorasan(this is Iranian part of Khorasan, rest of khorasan remained Sunni majority) finally became shiite majority.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 05:04:22 PM by rooyintan » Logged

Neo Bactra
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« Reply #61 on: March 15, 2008, 09:06:50 PM »

Quote from: Darius;7507
Neo Bactra-ye gerami,

It seems you are the one who's drawing hasty conclusions and even deciding for yourself on my whereabouts. No, I'm from Tajikistan mate. And it is in my habbit to call all Tajiks and Persian-speakers simply "Persian" or Tajik (Persian). "

And ostensibly you have misunderstood me again brother. Next time before quoting me or replying back to my message please try to read and digest it thoroughly. The message was not addressed to you only. I just spoke out and you put forward your view that did not reflect what I meant and I got back again to elaborate it further.

I've been witnessing here divisions like this and that are patriots implying that others should be known as non-patriots. It's a regressive and sectarian approach I believe, definition of the word "partiotism" is quite diverse. I'm well aware of our mobilization problems throughout my country (Iran, "Tajikistan", "Afghanistan", "Uzbekistan"...) and we can overcome them by putting aside this kind of divisions between ourselves with constructive discourses without blaming each other for meagre things.


Darius Aziz,

Salam/Dorood,

I honestly read your post twice in an attempt to "digest" it. It is ironical to see that we ask for the same thing. I asked you to ask for "clarification" and you ask me for "digestion". It Look as if we were on the same page. I just dont wish to personalize the thread any more. Going forward, if there is anything that requires further clarification, I will simply send you a private message and request you to do the same if that is ok with you. Of course, except for times that we deem that the subject matter is of a public nature and is essential for the Tajik common good. I am delighted to know that my Tajik brother hails from Tajikistan. However, I may sincerely request you to bear in mind that Tajiks of Afghistan have been subjected to unimaginable cruelty and hardships by the descendents of the Abdalis. Though we have common anscestors and culture, our degree of experiences differs. That difference psychologically affects our beharior and attitude. Hence, politically speaking, we have Tajik hawks and Tajik ducks (I hope this hawk and duck catagorization should not be interpreted as a "divisive" statement ;)). It's a very common phenomenon in every nation.

My Tajik brother, I wish you and the rest of our Tajiks success, unity and prosperity.

Wsalam/Pedrood
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 09:26:06 PM by Neo Bactra » Logged
Faridun
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« Reply #62 on: March 15, 2008, 09:15:04 PM »

Quote from: rooyintan;7513
With Safavid Empire established in Iran, shiite islam became official religion of the state, so Khorasan(this is Iranian part of Khorasan, rest of khorasan remained Sunni majority) finally became shiite majority.


You'd better say that turkish Safavid spread shiite islam by killing, torturing, and exploiting poor persian people. In 16 century turkish Qizilbash warriors kiilled most of the tajiks in Qarshi near Samarqand just because of their believes. Sunni Uzbek Shaibanid also killed a lot of persians in Khorasan.
These turks always brought seriouse problems to tajiks/persians in history abusing both sunni or shiite islam.
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Kambiz
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« Reply #63 on: March 15, 2008, 09:40:06 PM »

Neo Bactra,

Good advice, but hope you will practice it yourself first. Your last message had nothing to do with the public yet you'd chosen to publicize it.

There is no need to be delighted of my Tajikistani origin since all Persians are equally our brothers and sisters. There is yet less need to say "Darius is great and someone else is greater" in a different thread. Your evaluations hardly can change the picture. I don't see anything productive coming out of your derogatory tone brother.

If you are up for a change in our lives please try to change people's prejudice about us. Are you just trying to punch and run or would it be better to make them tell black from white? Some of them are really in need to be educated and directed, not told off. Being from Afghanistan doesn't justify your approach either. Tajikistani Persians have had the same share of misery if not more under Slavic and Turkic rulers and have lost many things to be counted. And I'm not sure if we are here to count them indeed. I thought we were trying to find a way to unity to fight for our sole cause. I haven't come here to face 'hawks and ducks' as you offensively put it. Since you might know that the term is 'hawks and doves'. I'd rather call ill-tempered, out of control minds 'ducks' as their ideas do not reach the height they might deserve and finally they turn into 'lame ducks'.

Now cease your fire and get back to constructive discos bro.

Pedrud

Quote from: Neo Bactra;7523
Darius Aziz,

Salam/Dorood,

I honestly read your post twice in an attempt to "digest" it. It is ironical to see that we ask for the same thing. I asked you to ask for "clarification" and you ask me for "digestion". It Look as if we were on the same page. I just dont wish to personalize the thread any more. Going forward, if there is anything that requires further clarification, I will simply send you a private message and request you to do the same if that is ok with you. Of course, except for times that we deem that the subject matter is of a public nature and is essential for the Tajik common good. I am delighted to know that my Tajik brother hails from Tajikistan. However, I may sincerely request you to bear in mind that Tajiks of Afghistan have been subjected to unimaginable cruelty and hardships by the descendents of the Abdalis. Though we have common anscestors and culture, our degree of experiences differs. That difference psychologically affects our beharior and attitude. Hence, politically speaking, we have Tajik hawks and Tajik ducks (I hope this hawk and duck catagorization should not be interpreted as a "divisive" statement ;)). It's a very common phenomenon in every nation.

My Tajik brother, I wish you and the rest of our Tajiks success, unity and prosperity.

Wsalam/Pedrood
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 09:44:34 PM by Kambiz » Logged
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« Reply #64 on: March 15, 2008, 09:43:13 PM »

That is the very reason why we ought to forget this silly Sunni/Shia and whatever divisions.

Quote from: Hassani Sabboh;7524
You'd better say that turkish Safavid spread shiite islam by killing, torturing, and exploiting poor persian people. In 16 century turkish Qizilbash warriors kiilled most of the tajiks in Qarshi near Samarqand just because of their believes. Sunni Uzbek Shaibanid also killed a lot of persians in Khorasan.
These turks always brought seriouse problems to tajiks/persians in history abusing both sunni or shiite islam.
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« Reply #65 on: March 15, 2008, 10:07:36 PM »

Quote from: Darius;7527
Neo Bactra,

Good advice, but hope you will practice it yourself first. Your last message had nothing to do with the public yet you'd chosen to publicize it.

There is no need to be delighted of my Tajikistani origin since all Persians are equally our brothers and sisters. There is yet less need to say "Darius is great and someone else is greater" in a different thread. Your evaluations hardly can change the picture. I don't see anything productive coming out of your derogatory tone brother.

If you are up for a change in our lives please try to change people's prejudice about us. Are you just trying to punch and run or would it be better to make them tell black from white? Some of them are really in need to be educated and directed, not told off. Being from Afghanistan doesn't justify your approach either. Tajikistani Persians have had the same share of misery if not more under Slavic and Turkic rulers and have lost many things to be counted. And I'm not sure if we are here to count them indeed. I thought we were trying to find a way to unity to fight for our sole cause. I haven't come here to face 'hawks and ducks' as you offensively put it. Since you might know that the term is 'hawks and doves'. I'd rather call ill-tempered, out of control minds 'ducks' as their ideas do not reach the height they might deserve and finally they turn into 'lame ducks'.

Now cease your fire and get back to constructive discos bro.

Pedrud


:) I find it funny. Let our Tajik brothers judge.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 10:28:49 PM by Neo Bactra » Logged
Kambiz
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« Reply #66 on: March 15, 2008, 10:49:45 PM »

What part of it particularly made you laugh, bro? The tale on 'lame ducks' or the tail of the ducks? hehe

Quote from: Neo Bactra;7531
:) I find it funny. Let our Tajik brothers judge.
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« Reply #67 on: March 15, 2008, 11:01:53 PM »

Quote from: Darius;7534
What part of it particularly made you laugh, bro? The tale on 'lame ducks' or the tail of the ducks? hehe


Check your "privates" :) Hopefully you wont find a tail there. lol  
I have sent you a message there.
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Kambiz
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« Reply #68 on: March 15, 2008, 11:06:14 PM »

Quote from: Neo Bactra;7536
Check your "privates" :) Hopefully you wont find a tail there. lol  
I have sent you a message there.


Sadly, I did find a feather in my box and sent it back to you dude.
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Parsistani
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« Reply #69 on: March 16, 2008, 06:02:25 AM »

Quote from: Hassani Sabboh;7524
You'd better say that turkish Safavid spread shiite islam by killing, torturing, and exploiting poor persian people. In 16 century turkish Qizilbash warriors kiilled most of the tajiks in Qarshi near Samarqand just because of their believes. Sunni Uzbek Shaibanid also killed a lot of persians in Khorasan.
These turks always brought seriouse problems to tajiks/persians in history abusing both sunni or shiite islam.


Safavids weren´t Turks, but of kurdish-persian origine.
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rooyintan
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« Reply #70 on: March 17, 2008, 05:56:15 AM »

Quote from: Parsistani;7554
Safavids weren´t Turks, but of kurdish-persian origine.


that's from father's side :-) But Shah Ismail's mother was of Turkish(Aq Qoyounlou Turkmen) and Greek(Trebizond/Byzantine) origins. So yes Shah Ismail and his descendants spoke Azerbaijani.
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« Reply #71 on: March 17, 2008, 08:58:23 AM »

Quote from: rooyintan;7637
that's from father's side :-) But Shah Ismail's mother was of Turkish(Aq Qoyounlou Turkmen) and Greek(Trebizond/Byzantine) origins. So yes Shah Ismail and his descendants spoke Azerbaijani.


Yes, Rooyintan-e gerami. It is well-documented by historians.
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« Reply #72 on: March 20, 2008, 12:34:16 PM »

Quote from: Darius;7645
Yes, Rooyintan-e gerami. It is well-documented by historians.

actually it is documented as persian aka iranian dynasty. Also their language was Tati, Aserbaidschani dialect of Persian...middle age Persian. They only had beside Persians, Turkish... also many turkish, in fact Turkmen soldier. In no book it is documented they were of ''turkish'' origine. Only Turks claim that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safavid


read what User Tajik wrote on the discuss page. He use very good preferences. Abbas mother was not a Turk but the princes of Greec (or his grandmother?). Just read.
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rooyintan
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« Reply #73 on: March 20, 2008, 05:49:21 PM »

Quote from: Parsistani;7753
actually it is documented as persian aka iranian dynasty. Also their language was Tati, Aserbaidschani dialect of Persian...middle age Persian. They only had beside Persians, Turkish... also many turkish, in fact Turkmen soldier. In no book it is documented they were of ''turkish'' origine. Only Turks claim that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safavid


read what User Tajik wrote on the discuss page. He use very good preferences. Abbas mother was not a Turk but the princes of Greec (or his grandmother?). Just read.

Please view Safavid's family tree:
http://www.4dw.net/royalark/Persia/safawi2.htm

As I said, from father's side, Shah Ismail I was son of Sheikh Haydar descendant of Sheikh Safi (a descendant of Firuz Shah) and from Mother's side(Halima Begi Agha) was daughter of Turkmen Uzun Hasan Shahanshah of Persia and Greek Princess Theodora Comnena(of Trebizond in Turkey).

Iranian historians write in history books that Safavid court language was Azerbaijani Turkish but official language of Persia was Persian.
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Kambiz
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« Reply #74 on: March 21, 2008, 08:40:04 PM »

Quote from: Parsistani;7753
actually it is documented as persian aka iranian dynasty. Also their language was Tati, Aserbaidschani dialect of Persian...middle age Persian. They only had beside Persians, Turkish... also many turkish, in fact Turkmen soldier. In no book it is documented they were of ''turkish'' origine. Only Turks claim that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safavid


read what User Tajik wrote on the discuss page. He use very good preferences. Abbas mother was not a Turk but the princes of Greec (or his grandmother?). Just read.


They were not Turkish, but of Azeri/Kurdish descent and it's written in all proper history books.
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