[Khurasanzad]

[QUOTE=Parsistani;13461]This is exactly that what I am always saying. Pashtuns were always slaves and dogs of other. Tajik generals and (sub-)ruler under all Turco-Persian and Persian were f*** and **raping** them for centuries. Tahirids were killing this dogs as they would kill cockroaches, Samanids were making them to slaves and sold them to Turks, Ghaznavids were cuting their head off or hanged them on elephantes. These bastards were always raped by others. Even their rulers were either slave, results of raping, or sexual toys. Nalat bar qaum e kharan. Pakhtun=children of Israel, Turks, Mongols, Arabs, Pakis, Indians, Russians, Americans, GB, Tajiks, Iranis and even of Kurds.[/QUOTE]

You shouldn´t forget that then we had other times and other ideologies. I also never heard that Tajiks raped other only to strech their empires over their countries. It´s surely a lie. But what fact is Tajiks were very often rulers and subrulers and they did a lot of slaves in Pakistan and India, mostly because they wanted to spread Islam and introduce it to their slaves.

[Sohrab]

[QUOTE=Parsistani;13500]So you say it is ok for them to be wild because they were our slaves in the past? You say these dogs shall take revange for what other did to them?? I say, what other did they did it best and we have to do also the same and kill them to zero. I say, it´s our right to take revange. these cultureless dogs, who really believe they made other to slave while they were self slave, need death. Your posts are not smart. Lol[/QUOTE]

Dear Parsistani, The problem in this post of yours is that you claim to be curel to the pushtoons in the past, raping their women, killing them, keeping them as salve. Can you tell me when did all these happen? If they really happend then we are no any better than Abul Rahman Khan and the Taliban. We started to punish the Pushtoons for nothing and now they are taking revenge by being wild or whatever you call it.

[Ariaie-kabulzadah]

[QUOTE=Azar_Khorasani;12648]There is a "slogan" among Pashtun tribes of Afghanistan that [every Tajik woman was rapped by Pashtun and they call every Tajiks their children]. In the aftermath of Latif Pedram's interview with Khorasan TV in regards to Shah Amanullah Khan.
Members of Afghan party held a meeting in Germany and in that meeting the representative of the party, Abdul Khaliq Noori, repeated the slogan in Pashtu. he stated that Tajiks are the children of Pashtuns, we are the fathers to them.

I am posting this to let you people be the judge of it. Calling a nation their bastards children is a pure racist allegation and religious assault to people in Afghanistan!


You can listen to Mr. Noori saying it in this clip that copied from youtube[/QUOTE]


Salam baradar aziz,

Can you pleeeeeaaaassse tell me were I can see that interview with Dr. Latif Pedram?

Thanks in advance,
M. Ariaie:)

[Khurasani]

[quote=Ariaie-kabulzadah;13520]Salam baradar aziz,

Can you pleeeeeaaaassse tell me were I can see that interview with Dr. Latif Pedram?

Thanks in advance,
M. Ariaie:)[/quote]

I think you mean this : http://tajikam.com/f...read.php?t=3492

[Sohrab]

[QUOTE=Parsistani;13461] Pashtuns were always slaves and dogs of other. Tajik generals and (sub-)ruler under all Turco-Persian and Persian were f*** and **raping** them for centuries. Tahirids were killing this dogs as they would kill cockroaches, Samanids were making them to slaves and sold them to Turks, Ghaznavids were cuting their head off or hanged them on elephantes. .[/QUOTE]

Will you please provide the source of your information please?

[dokhtare pulegun]

Parsistani doesn't have any sources. Everything he posts is just a foaming rant. I don't know why anyone takes him seriously.

[Madina]

@Unity
I agree with you. We cannot judge an entire Nation based on what few of them have done or what their great grand fathers have done. I was going through this other Tajik Forum and what I noticed there was that on one hand we insult Pashtuns and laugh at them, but on the other we claim Pashtun people like Ahmad Zahir, Jawad Ghaziyar and etcetera to be Tajiks. Just because they sing in Dari and we like them, that's why we make up stuff and lies about them so that we can ensure they look like on of us. And even though current Miss Afghanistan is a Pashtun, yet we claim her to be Tajik as well even though she very clearly said in the Contest she cannot speak Dari. Either we hate majority of Pashtuns but like some of them because of their Music, or either we hate the entire Pashtun Nation but then we shouldn't make fun of ourselves and tag the Pashtuns that are popular as Tajiks.

I am seeing this ethical tension everywhere and I heard even in Tajikistan Persian speaking Tajiks and Russian speaking Tajiks are in argument with each other. I have had enough of it because in my own family a family member's life is completely ruined because of this stupid arguments between Tajiks and non-Tajiks. I want all Tajiks to do something for our Tajiks around the world and help them give a better future, why don't we spend our time on those we love instead on those we hate? And by the way, we have enough great singers like Sareban, Najim Nawabi, Hangama and etcetera, so why would we even need anyone from another ethnic? If we are proud Tajiks and love our culture and language, then we don't need to bring down other ethnics just make ourselves look better or to boost our Tajik pride. We can do better than that, don't we?

[Parsistani]

Ahmad Zahir was a Furmuli (Tajik). His father as some other Tajiks hided their origine during the ethno-centric Pashtun dictatory. Ghazyar, an old good friend of my father is a Tajik. His name..is a Tajik and he identify himself as a proud Farsiwan.

[Madina]

^ Ne azizam, en ishtaba-e man ham bud. I have got family in California who are in touch with Rishad Zahir (Ahmad Zahir's son) and his wife, who is an Kandahari, and my family even had been to their wedding. From them I heard Ahmad Zahir was a Pashtun and Rishad even speaks Pashto with his children, even though his Pashto is believed to be quiet weak. Ahmad Zahir was raised in Kabul and therefore his Pashto was very weak but everyone knows they are Pashtuns from Laghman. And by the way, Laghman is a province of which one half is dominated by Tajiks and other half by Pashtuns and they have no problem with each other. Plus there are quiet some Laghmani's here in the UK and as far as I have met them, half of them are Tajiks or Nurestani's en other half are Pashtuns.

And I don't know very much about Jawad Ghaziyar but when I saw his son's song, then I asked my friend whether he was a Hazara because he looked like one. She said no and said his father is a Pashtun and Jawad's father even had only Pashto songs, but he wasn't as famous. But even they are Pashtuns. And my point isn't who is Pashtun and who is Tajik, but my point is that there is no need to bring Politics everywhere. Why can't we at least enjoy songs without being Political? And besides, Ebi, Najim Nawabi, Hangama, Sarban and few more are some of the greatest singers I have seen and heard of and who are all Tajiks, so we got plenty of talent as well, Jonam.

[Administrator]

Madina, on 09 August 2009 - 05:01 PM, said:

^ Ne azizam, en ishtaba-e man ham bud. I have got family in California who are in touch with Rishad Zahir (Ahmad Zahir's son) and his wife, who is an Kandahari, and my family even had been to their wedding. From them I heard Ahmad Zahir was a Pashtun and Rishad even speaks Pashto with his children, even though his Pashto is believed to be quiet weak. Ahmad Zahir was raised in Kabul and therefore his Pashto was very weak but everyone knows they are Pashtuns from Laghman. And by the way, Laghman is a province of which one half is dominated by Tajiks and other half by Pashtuns and they have no problem with each other. Plus there are quiet some Laghmani's here in the UK and as far as I have met them, half of them are Tajiks or Nurestani's en other half are Pashtuns.

And I don't know very much about Jawad Ghaziyar but when I saw his son's song, then I asked my friend whether he was a Hazara because he looked like one. She said no and said his father is a Pashtun and Jawad's father even had only Pashto songs, but he wasn't as famous. But even they are Pashtuns. And my point isn't who is Pashtun and who is Tajik, but my point is that there is no need to bring Politics everywhere. Why can't we at least enjoy songs without being Political? And besides, Ebi, Najim Nawabi, Hangama, Sarban and few more are some of the greatest singers I have seen and heard of and who are all Tajiks, so we got plenty of talent as well, Jonam.

Dorood,

Ahmad Zahir's family are Tajiks from Northern Laghman and they also have pashayis in their family. The thing with Laghmanis and other eastern Tajiks is that they hide their true ethnic identity from others, this especially happened in the 20th century and most indeitfied themselves as Pashtuns. Khalilzad is one of these individuals who thinks he is a Pashtun but the reality is that he is a Tajik Laghmani. Dr. Zahir however, never identified himself as a Pashtun. Suraya Baha, who worked for the census department in the 1970s told me that when the national census was launched (which never finished) they first started surveying people from the eastern provinces and 45% said they were Tajik, Farsiwan, or farsizaban and only 35% identified themselves as Pashtun.

Jawad Ghaziyar is a Persianized Pashtun and I have many recordings of him making fun of Pashtuns.

[Sohrab]

Madina, on 08 August 2009 - 10:16 PM, said:

@Unity
I agree with you. We cannot judge an entire Nation based on what few of them have done or what their great grand fathers have done. I was going through this other Tajik Forum and what I noticed there was that on one hand we insult Pashtuns and laugh at them, but on the other we claim Pashtun people like Ahmad Zahir, Jawad Ghaziyar and etcetera to be Tajiks. Just because they sing in Dari and we like them, that's why we make up stuff and lies about them so that we can ensure they look like on of us. And even though current Miss Afghanistan is a Pashtun, yet we claim her to be Tajik as well even though she very clearly said in the Contest she cannot speak Dari. Either we hate majority of Pashtuns but like some of them because of their Music, or either we hate the entire Pashtun Nation but then we shouldn't make fun of ourselves and tag the Pashtuns that are popular as Tajiks.

I am seeing this ethical tension everywhere and I heard even in Tajikistan Persian speaking Tajiks and Russian speaking Tajiks are in argument with each other. I have had enough of it because in my own family a family member's life is completely ruined because of this stupid arguments between Tajiks and non-Tajiks. I want all Tajiks to do something for our Tajiks around the world and help them give a better future, why don't we spend our time on those we love instead on those we hate? And by the way, we have enough great singers like Sareban, Najim Nawabi, Hangama and etcetera, so why would we even need anyone from another ethnic? If we are proud Tajiks and love our culture and language, then we don't need to bring down other ethnics just make ourselves look better or to boost our Tajik pride. We can do better than that, don't we?

dear madina, although i agree with many points you mentioned above, but i have to clarify a few things to you: if there is no proof that zahir was tajik, there is also no proof he was pushtoon, we have got friendship with zahir's unncl's family, you cant see a tiny element of pashto in them, i say this because i am originally from laghman. even if he was pushtoon, i never see a problem in this, he was good guy, an amazing singer, everyone loves him, alll his artistic work was in farsi, so his ethnicity is not a problem for me, on the other hand you are right that we have many many highly talented tajik artists whom we should be proud of them, you are also right that we should try to improve the condition of tajiks and even try to promote understanding with other ethnic groups including pushtoons, in this case everybody will have a good future. let me tell you one thing that you mostly blamed tajiks for the ethnic tenstions and hatred, this is not true, tajiks were not the starter of this hatred, it was pushtoon rulers. go to any pushtoon website and see how they hate tajiks.

[ANSARI]

Unity touched upon a great point here which seems to have silenced the ignorant. If the Tajiks and Turks dominated Pashtuns for centuries, they have no right to have the same treatment metted to them over the last 2 centuries.

I dont suscribe to this view, I just find it ironic

[Sohrab]

Unity, on 14 August 2009 - 11:21 AM, said:

dear madina, although i agree with many points you mentioned above, but i have to clarify a few things to you: if there is no proof that zahir was tajik, there is also no proof he was pushtoon, we have got friendship with zahir's unncl's family, you cant see a tiny element of pashto in them, i say this because i am originally from laghman. even if he was pushtoon, i never see a problem in this, he was good guy, an amazing singer, everyone loves him, alll his artistic work was in farsi, so his ethnicity is not a problem for me, on the other hand you are right that we have many many highly talented tajik artists whom we should be proud of them, you are also right that we should try to improve the condition of tajiks and even try to promote understanding with other ethnic groups including pushtoons, in this case everybody will have a good future. let me tell you one thing that you mostly blamed tajiks for the ethnic tenstions and hatred, this is not true, tajiks were not the starter of this hatred, it was pushtoon rulers. go to any pushtoon website and see how they hate tajiks.

the tajiks never ill treated other groups in the past when they were rulers. as a matter of fact ethnic divisions never existed in that time. parsistani is completely wrong to claim that the tajiks have done anything wrong to the others in those times, it is also wrong to blame pushtoon public for the crimes of pushtoon rulers, they are poor and ordinary people just like us.

[Sohrab]

oppss,i replied to my own post, it mean to be to ANSARI

[asif1986]

Gul agha, on 12 August 2009 - 11:01 PM, said:

Dorood,

The thing with Laghmanis and other eastern Tajiks is that they hide their true ethnic identity from others, this especially happened in the 20th century and most indeitfied themselves as Pashtuns.

Why do they hide their identity, are they afraid of getting massacred by pashtuns.

[Madina]

@Gul Agha
If Ahmad Zahir truly was a Tajik then it's good because he was THE King of Persian Music and still is. But I have met quiet some Pashtuns who speak Dari and I always thought they were Tajiks, mainly because of their behaviour as well. But as I said here in UK there are a lot of Laghmani's, both Tajiks and Pashtuns and those people get along perfectly fine with each other and told me even back in Laghman they are happy together. Maybe Unity can tell more about it. But as I also said I know people who are in touch with his son and daughter-in-law and they told me they are Pashtuns by ethnic. Though his wife is believed to be a Tajik from Kabul. And as far as Jawad is considered, I have seen Kandahari's and Laghmani's make fun of themselves as well but they still love their natives. But even then, a Pashtun can never become a Tajik, no matter how hard he tries. And nor do I accept any Tajik who calls himself a Pashtun, because he is either ashamed of being an Tajik or either he is that much of a coward that he values his life more than his Identity and reality. I love my people and my culture and I cannot stand people who 'exchange' their Identity because it makes them look like an coward, no matter whatever the reason is.


@Unity
Nee Azizam, I am not blaming anyone. Because I love Tajiks, I care for Tajiks and I am an proud Tajik myself, I don't want my Tajiks to do same things which Pashtuns have done, because of which many people hate them. Simple because I don't want people to hate on us as well and if someone is being lame infront of us then we shouldn't stoop to their level. We can do better than that. And this hatred might remain for a long time but SOMEONE has to make a move towards peace, don't you think? I remember reading somewhere where it was written that a Pashtun Leader targetted Hazara's for his actions, and Tajiks also joined Pashtuns in their crimes against Hazara's. That might be one of the reasons why I sometimes see Hazara's curse at Tajiks as well. We cannot blame an entire Ethnic for their past of their fore-fathers, because if we hate them for their cruelty, then where is the difference if we become cruel as well? My heart breaks for those poor and innocent civillians in Afghanistan suffering because of this Ethical idiocy; May they be Pashtuns, may they be Tajiks or even Hazara's, who have already suffered a lot as well.

[asif1986]

It is believed that Ghilzais are only pashtuns from the maternal side and that they were offspring of the sin.

[Madina]

What happened to the new guy named Sam's posts? :|

[Parsistani]

Gul agha, on 12 August 2009 - 10:01 PM, said:

Dorood,

Ahmad Zahir's family are Tajiks from Northern Laghman and they also have pashayis in their family. The thing with Laghmanis and other eastern Tajiks is that they hide their true ethnic identity from others, this especially happened in the 20th century and most indeitfied themselves as Pashtuns. Khalilzad is one of these individuals who thinks he is a Pashtun but the reality is that he is a Tajik Laghmani. Dr. Zahir however, never identified himself as a Pashtun. Suraya Baha, who worked for the census department in the 1970s told me that when the national census was launched (which never finished) they first started surveying people from the eastern provinces and 45% said they were Tajik, Farsiwan, or farsizaban and only 35% identified themselves as Pashtun.

Jawad Ghaziyar is a Persianized Pashtun and I have many recordings of him making fun of Pashtuns.

Yes, it is true that many claimed during Daus Khan beeing Pashtuns but can you please bring some documents to use them on some articles?

[Parsistani]

Azar_Khorasani, on 01 August 2008 - 12:59 AM, said:

There is a "slogan" among Pashtun tribes of Afghanistan that [every Tajik woman was rapped by Pashtun and they call every Tajiks their children]. In the aftermath of Latif Pedram's interview with Khorasan TV in regards to Shah Amanullah Khan.
Members of Afghan party held a meeting in Germany and in that meeting the representative of the party, Abdul Khaliq Noori, repeated the slogan in Pashtu. he stated that Tajiks are the children of Pashtuns, we are the fathers to them.

I am posting this to let you people be the judge of it. Calling a nation their bastards children is a pure racist allegation and religious assault to people in Afghanistan!


You can listen to Mr. Noori saying it in this clip that copied from youtube

A friend of mine and a neighbour of me on youtube wrote once to me (he thought I am a Pashtun) the following which also made some things much clear and fascinated me. Just read

Leader2OO7, on 01 August 2010 - 12:59 AM, said:

You know why you prefere to speak in the language of your father (Persian)? Because your mum was a Pushtun whore running for Tajik men and their money. Unfortunately, she became once pregnant and bore a Harami (you) and presented your current father as ''his'' daughter. You should know, a Pashmtoon as you claim, can not speak Persian, except if he is a Harami. I bet, you can´t even speak one word pagha dagha shit.

The same will happen to you and your children will be Haramis but don´t lie yourself or your future cave-monkey husband the haramian are his children..and you know what? I guess, even your mum and your father are of haramian background and speak Persian but claim beeing PigTuns LOL what kind of hypocrite shit and sand niggers you wannabe Fucktuns are. Neither FuckTuns wants you, nor Persianspeaker. Today, you get hunted and killed...because you are pretending beeing Pashmtoons and Persianspeakers. Good luck, we will get you, too.

But don´t worry, only 65% of pretended ''Pushtuns'' are Haramian, not all. There are many who are real Pushtuns and speak in their native language and do not send their daughters and wifes for prostitutions to bring Haramian home. Just ask your mum, why a Harami like you, sa you believe your adday is a Pushtun, do not speak Pushtu or can´t speak Pushtu? She will not tell ya from beginning the truth but keep on her. She will get soft and tell you her secrets. Till than, be careful or your fake adaay will sell you or exchange you with a cattle.