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Monomaniacal Disease of Afghans Rate Topic: -----

#61 User is offline   Badmash Khan Icon

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Posted 27 September 2009 - 11:56 PM

View PostGul agha, on 26 September 2009 - 06:25 PM, said:

You are twisting my words. I said that the vast majority doesn't support Ghani but the tiny minority who voted for Ghani were ethnocentrist Pashtuns.


ahh yes, all the ethno centrists voted for the clean shaving, western educated relatively secularist Ghani who condemned the Taliban!!!

can you please substantiate your charge with proof? or at least, a speculation thats well argued and articulated?
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#62 User is offline   TajikGunner Icon

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 08:52 PM

View PostJalal al Din Khan, on 20 September 2009 - 08:14 AM, said:

Im sorry, I think you misunderstood my comment. I didnt ask for your opinion, as you have already shared it. I asked for you to substantiate your claim with a source, link, documentation etc

If the sole source of your claim that Ashraf Ghani Ahmadzai is a necktie wearing Talib, is the notion that he was sympathetic to the movement when it first emerged, then this is a poor argument (again, assuming you can substantiate it)

It is poor because a significant number of Pashtuns were fooled into sympathezing with the Taliban when it first emerged for several reasons.

1. The hidden hand of the Pakistani security apparatus was not apparent in the beginning of the movement except for a few insiders who were privy to that information
2. The Taliban publicly declared no claim to power, and only sought to eradicate lawlessness and unislamic behaviour amongst the various warlords, and sought to restore justice and law
3. Some Taliban openly flirted with the notion of restoring Zahir Shah to the throne, which was a welcome development
4. Many Afghans, not just Pashtuns, welcomed the Talibs with open arms as they presented an excellent alternative to the prevailing circumstances at the time
5. Although the Taliban were a Pashtun militia, there was no indication that they sought to monopolize power in Pashtun hands and oppress the other ethnicites

I would go so far as to say, that anyone who wasnt tied explicitly to one or more of the Jihadi factions locked in battle, was sympathetic to the Taliban when they first emerged. Many Pashtun intelligensia openly sympathized with a vigilante movement that sought to eradicate the lawlessness and brutality of the 90s militias. These same members of the Pashtun intelligensia, with the exception of those who tied themselves to the regime (and this included many Jihadis, and even Khalqis), one by one over the course of the regime, denounced the Taliban.

You may not be aware of this, as you seem to recieve news and information from a narrow ethnically focused source, but there were even delegations of exiled Pashtun notables who travelled to Afghanistan to meet with the Talib shura and implore them to change some of their policies (ie. ethnic polarization, religious fundementalism, etc). As the Taliban consolidated their hold over Afghanistan, and moved closer to Al Qaeda, they became increasingly unwilling to accept opposing views, thus alienating the majority of Pashtuns who originally sympathized with them. This is why the Taliban regime fell so easily, and why resistance was minimal in 2001.

So denouncing Ashraf Ghani for originally sympathizing with the Taliban, as millions of Afghans did, is dishonest. This same Ashraf Ghani openly favoured excluding Taliban regime remnants, however "moderate", from the Bonn Conference because the Taliban had so openly flaunted and disobeyed international conventions. Indeed, if you were to objectively research Ashraf Ghanis life and politics, you will see very little that ties him to the Taliban. This is the same man who openly denounced the Taliban as "Jahil" in Feb 2001 (http://www.effectivestates.org/Articles/Death%20and%20Taxes%20in%20Kabul.pdf).

This is a man who is without a doubt, one of the most capable minds our country has produced. What he did at the Ministry of Finance speaks for itself. He was the only major presidential candidate, who didnt campaign on ethnicity, or power politics, but on a actual, concise platform, with clear facts, figures and benchmarks. The majority of you people supported Dr Abdullah, who offered NO SPECIFICS OR POLICIES, but simply ran on an Anti Karzai ticket.

I can understand how some of you may be suspicious about a Pashtun elite such as Ashraf Ghani, and considering the history of our nation and the behaviour of our Pashtun elite, such suspicion is certainly valid. But in the case of Ashraf Ghani, NOTHING exists to actualize that suspicion into outright hostility, and in fact, any objective review of his life, policies and achievements will automatically dispel any suspicions

I would venture, the real reason for your hate, and the real reason why Gul Agha slanders him with unsubstianted lies, is that the notion of an educated, progressive Pashtun is a threat to your fraudalent ideology. It is in your best interest, for the image of Pashtuns to continue to remain that of a backwards, uneducated lot, so that your pseudo racist jibberish can have any validation.


Viewing political developments in Afghanistan through a simplistic, black and white narrative exposes your lack of knowledge.




What....are you trying to create another bAbA in this country, at the end of the long line of many other idiotic bAbAs who have ruled over the destiny of our people? :lol: He can be a bAba for Pashtons, with his feminine, funny voice, but he means nothing to us. He is not going to have any influence or authority over our people.

Pashton and intelligentsia are terms in clear contradiction and this Ahmaqzai is no exception to that convention. He was a supporter of Taliban then (just like Kharzai) and he is a sympathizer now.

He called them "sons" of Mirwais Neka and Ahmad Khan Durrani (bacha berish of Nadir Shah Afshaar), and for that reasons, among others, he'll never have support within Tajiks, Hazaras, Nooristani and others........

We welcome real educated Pashtons. With educated Pashtons we hope to have discussions based on historical facts and not empty emotions. We don't want uneducated morons like that Alam Khan Kuchi, who declared the feelings of educated and uneducated Pashtons in the parliament as such: Awghanistan belongs first to Kuchis and second to Pashtons exclusively.

We’re waiting to see a Pashton who is not into fraud. You don’t want Pashtons like that idiot Abdul Hai Habibi who faked Puta Khazana and invented history for “Pashton literature” trying to connect Pashtons to this country, when we know that Pashtons are a new phenomenon in Khorassan......or Kharzai who faked votes with view to win the election.....do you?

Ahmaqzai is not adequately educated, at least not with the history of the country. His understandings of ethnic dynamics of the country are flawed, like most Pashtons. He has a seriously flawed mentality which prevents him from reaching and accessing the truth and that can't be underestimated.

You know it, that Tajiks, as the settled and urbanized population of the country, are the educated and cultured elite of the country. No Pashton can match Tajiks in field of arts, culture, farming (irrigation) administrative skills, trade, education and now even military prowess.
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#63 User is offline   shabir Icon

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 11:44 AM

View PostTajikGunner, on 30 September 2009 - 08:52 PM, said:

What....are you trying to create another bAbA in this country, at the end of the long line of many other idiotic bAbAs who have ruled over the destiny of our people? :lol: He can be a bAba for Pashtons, with his feminine, funny voice, but he means nothing to us. He is not going to have any influence or authority over our people.

Pashton and intelligentsia are terms in clear contradiction and this Ahmaqzai is no exception to that convention. He was a supporter of Taliban then (just like Kharzai) and he is a sympathizer now.

He called them "sons" of Mirwais Neka and Ahmad Khan Durrani (bacha berish of Nadir Shah Afshaar), and for that reasons, among others, he'll never have support within Tajiks, Hazaras, Nooristani and others........

We welcome real educated Pashtons. With educated Pashtons we hope to have discussions based on historical facts and not empty emotions. We don't want uneducated morons like that Alam Khan Kuchi, who declared the feelings of educated and uneducated Pashtons in the parliament as such: Awghanistan belongs first to Kuchis and second to Pashtons exclusively.

We’re waiting to see a Pashton who is not into fraud. You don’t want Pashtons like that idiot Abdul Hai Habibi who faked Puta Khazana and invented history for “Pashton literature” trying to connect Pashtons to this country, when we know that Pashtons are a new phenomenon in Khorassan......or Kharzai who faked votes with view to win the election.....do you?

Ahmaqzai is not adequately educated, at least not with the history of the country. His understandings of ethnic dynamics of the country are flawed, like most Pashtons. He has a seriously flawed mentality which prevents him from reaching and accessing the truth and that can't be underestimated.

You know it, that Tajiks, as the settled and urbanized population of the country, are the educated and cultured elite of the country. No Pashton can match Tajiks in field of arts, culture, farming (irrigation) administrative skills, trade, education and now even military prowess.

the problem is that both sides will never accept anyone from the opposite ethnic as their hero. tajiks dislike ahmad shah abdali and pashtuns detest ahmad shah masood and i think reason behind it that none of these people tried to do anything good for the entire country. pashtuns always sided pashtuns and ahmad shah masood saved tajiks and especially panjsheris from pakis. i have lost hope in all of them and if u ask me then from karzai to ghani to dostum to abdullah are all sold outs. lets not get fooled by their ethnic and background but i can surely say anyone who will be the bravest puppy, that one will be selected by usa. may it be karzai again or ghani or abdullah or whatever. i dont even care anymore
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#64 User is offline   shabir Icon

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Posted 05 October 2009 - 11:49 AM

View PostGul agha, on 26 September 2009 - 06:25 PM, said:

You are twisting my words. I said that the vast majority doesn't support Ghani but the tiny minority who voted for Ghani were ethnocentrist Pashtuns.

so it means only tiny lil minority pashtuns is now facist? all that i know now is that all afghans are very hungry right now and they need food and shelter. lets hope if a true candidate doesnt win then atleast an true person can come up and feed those hungry ones. if any candidate had any honesty then atleast they would have done something which could make us believe that he indeed would be our leader. not usa's and nor pakistans. those poor ones dont want any pashtun or tajik or hazara leader, they just want food and we and our candidates can talk all we want and promise all we want but the question is, are we capable of fulfilling our promise for once and help those in need? or have we done anything at all to convince our poor people? and the answer is, no
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#65 User is offline   Parsistani Icon

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 01:21 PM

View PostJalal al Din Khan, on 18 September 2009 - 07:27 PM, said:

can you please substantiate, with proof, your assertion that Ashraf Ghani Ahmadzai is a necktie wearing Taliban (lol). I eagerly await your response

As for the Durand Line, as a Pashtun, I have always felt that any claim to Pashtun lands, automatically voids any claim we have to north of the Hindu Kush. We cant have it both ways, and this is an idea that is lost on Pashtun nationalists.

i also have always felt that there needs to be an official plesbicite in Pakhtukhwa regarding unification. If the Pashtuns of Pakistan indicate in a free and open election, that they choose to be with Pakistan, then that ends all debate on the Durand Line


Read that http://tajikam.com/f...id=381&Itemid=1
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